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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 20 post(s) |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
310
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Posted - 2013.04.08 18:51:00 -
[1] - Quote
As many others have stated, I'm a bit sad about the Hyp. The rep bonus pretty much makes it useful only in small gang/solo situations, where every piece of tackle matters. Removing its fifth mid really reduces the Hyp's effectiveness in both of these situations.
As far as the Mega goes, I'm not particularly happy with the new slot layout either. While the ships are occasionally shield tanked in a goofy attempt to make a big, less effective Talos, the reality is that the Mega is far more likely to be armor tanked. Taking away a low slot means you're losing either 10k EHP or 150 DPS in order to gain a utility mid. I'm not sure about anyone else, but having that extra tank or DPS is far more useful in most situations than a second web. If you're going up against ECM, then sure, the fifth mid is handy for an ECCM, but in every other situation, the low slot is far more valuable.
As a side note, a lot of people are bitching about the large fleet applicability of these ships. While I understand that it sucks that Gallente ships aren't as good for large fleets, it's not necessarily a bad thing for the game. Gallente ships tend to be monsters in small gangs, and I'd hate to see their ability to be effective on the small scale in the name of making them "fleet viable." |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
310
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 19:03:00 -
[2] - Quote
Michael Harari wrote:I really dont see why people hate on the armor rep bonus. Its really really good.
It's because they can't take advantage of it while in a fleet with 100 other people, therefore it's bad.
Don't you know, solo/small gang pvp is dead. No blob, no pvp. |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
310
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 19:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
Mithrantir Ob'lontra wrote:Tell that to the Neutralizers that will land on you the second they target you.
It doesn't take 100 to kill your cap.
True, but this argument is applicable to any active tanked (non-ASB) ship. With dual cap boosters you can stay up against a fair number of neuts, but not an overwhelming amount. |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
311
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Posted - 2013.04.08 19:37:00 -
[4] - Quote
Mithrantir Ob'lontra wrote:Great. With 4 mid slots and the apparent need for a MJD and a secondary propulsion mod, adding 2 cap boosters really helps the Hyperion to do something at least equal to the other 3 tier 3 Battleships.
I think not. And even if you don't use a MJD. You still are left with one (1) mid slot to fit what? A web? An eccm? A scrambler?
Somehow I can't rejoice trying to solve this dilemma.
If you read my first post in this thread, you'll see that it is my opinion that the Hyp absolutely needs 5 mids to be effective. Though I much rather run dual cap, scram + web, and either MWD or MJD, rather than dual proping it. The web is just far too valuable to the ship's ability to actually apply its damage to remove.
My point in my previous several posts is that many of the comments in this thread are complaining about how terrible active rep bonuses are. While they are not helpful in large fleets, they can be very effective if used right in solo/small gang fights. |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
311
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 19:43:00 -
[5] - Quote
Saul Hyperion wrote: Drop the utility high, restore the low and the Megathron is heading down the right track.
But I love the neut on my mega  |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
312
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 19:56:00 -
[6] - Quote
Saul Hyperion wrote:I hate it. Need fitting (and cap, especially with this new RoF bonus) for other things 
Does fine on cap, except under heavy neuting pressure. As far as fitting goes, you're trading 6k EHP (T2 plates) and 4km on your point to gain a heavy neut. Amazingly good trade, in my opinion. |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
312
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 20:24:00 -
[7] - Quote
Grideris wrote:Adriel Malakai wrote:Saul Hyperion wrote:I hate it. Need fitting (and cap, especially with this new RoF bonus) for other things  Does fine on cap, except under heavy neuting pressure. As far as fitting goes, you're trading 6k EHP (T2 plates) and 4km on your point to gain a heavy neut. Amazingly good trade, in my opinion. I run more or less the same thing, except with T2 plates and a medium booster. Do you find the extra cap injection ability is actually useful? My fit gets about 16k more armour HP from the look of things. Back to the topic at hand: don't touch my utility high on the Mega.
Depends on the situation. If there are any neuts on the field, the extra cap injection is invaluable. |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
312
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 23:04:00 -
[8] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:I want to respond to a few of these points since they seem to be coming up a lot, though I'm not sure why.
First the tank - I showed you the armor tank that people are most likely to use, 2 plate, 2eanm, 1 dcu - this is the standard mega armor tank and its still completely viable. Now, you have the same tank, similar damage, but your ship goes faster and you have an extra mid. Seems like a fair trade.
And as far as the Talos. I would never expect this ship to compete with the Talos as a roaming kiter. That is not whats intended by "fast and agile". If you want to see some value from fast and agile, think about a situation where you have a new shiny armageddon tackled by your friend in a stiletto. The geddon is perma jammed by your friend in a blackbird. But! You have just jumped through the gate and are 35k away from the armageddon! Now, as you close in, the armageddon has 2 friends show up! An oneiros and a falcon. Now you have to make a run for the gate as fast as possible. This is just one example of where a BS's speed matters. If you are in a hyperion, you will struggle to get over there and apply damage in anywhere near the time-frame that this attack mega can. There's many other examples, but I just want to make the point that just because a ship can't kite as well as a Talos, that doesn't mean speed is not important.
As a final point for comparing BS vs Tier3 BC. Always consider the way they would perform vs each other. How does this new mega do in a 1v1 vs a Talos?
The problem with the extra mid is that you don't gain a lot from having it when using an armor tank relative to the extra low. Where the mid really helps is when you're trying to shield tank the mega, but you're pretty much always better off with a shield talos than a shield mega. So the question is whether or not that extra mid slot is actually worth having over the extra low in most situations. In my opinion, the answer is no by an extremely wide margin. |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
313
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 23:47:00 -
[9] - Quote
Olaf4862 wrote:Not to rain on your parade, but just use drones for neuting have get them to buff them so they work better.
I keep thinking that removing the 1 high on the mega and put it in the mid is the way to go. This along with fixes to drones could make the mega extremely potent as a shield or armor tank with a full flight of drones for dps or utility.
Of course this would mean making heavy drones not suck in pvp...
Using 4 Praetor EV-900s, you'd neut 100GJ less cap per 24s (heavy neut cycle time) than the neut. Add that to losing 200+dps to not having heavy drones (or 150+dps for mediums), and that the drones can be killed super easy, and this is a terrible idea. Neut drones are bad. |

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
313
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 00:11:00 -
[10] - Quote
Havegun Willtravel wrote:Using 5 Praetro EV-900's you'd neut the same amount. And not use any of your own cap in the process. Neut drones are not a common choice, but they can work. They become a reasonable choice in a 150 or 175 drone bay with 125 bandwidth <-- Hint Hint Rise.
The proposed Mega only has 100mb of bandwidth, meaning you can use at most four. If we're going to change the proposed slot layout, it's honestly way better off staying 8/4/7 with the bay reduction, than it is with a 7/5/7 layout, but with a larger drone bay/bandwidth so it can viably use neut drones instead of a heavy neut. That still doesn't take into account how retardedly easy it is to mitigate drone neuting, which is enough to make them a poor decision without even needing to take drone bandwidth into account. |
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Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
313
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 00:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Bouh Revetoile wrote:Second, regarding PWG, because the Hyperion lose a mid slot, that's one less heavy cap booster and that many PWG freed.
That's nice and all, except you can't reasonably power 2 armor reps on only one cap booster. |
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